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	<title>Comments on: Mayors defend Olympic Village</title>
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	<link>http://www.francesbula.com/2008-vancouver-civic-election/mayors-defend-olympic-village/</link>
	<description>Vancouver city life and politics</description>
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		<title>By: Colleen</title>
		<link>http://www.francesbula.com/2008-vancouver-civic-election/mayors-defend-olympic-village/comment-page-1/#comment-1460</link>
		<dc:creator>Colleen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 14 Nov 2008 05:30:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.francesbula.com/?p=596#comment-1460</guid>
		<description>And thats the distortion its not about being part of the negotiations but being told that the city would be going into negotations despite being promised by the city there would be no Olympic bailouts.  Nice try.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And thats the distortion its not about being part of the negotiations but being told that the city would be going into negotations despite being promised by the city there would be no Olympic bailouts.  Nice try.</p>
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		<title>By: Colleen</title>
		<link>http://www.francesbula.com/2008-vancouver-civic-election/mayors-defend-olympic-village/comment-page-1/#comment-1457</link>
		<dc:creator>Colleen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 14 Nov 2008 04:45:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.francesbula.com/?p=596#comment-1457</guid>
		<description>Whatever caused the leak its a done deal but there is no excuse especially from Larry Campbell who promised tax payers they would not be on the hook for any further costs and then goes on to defend bailout.  What happended?  The province  was on the hook not the city.  What happened to the province as Campbell promised to pick up the costs?Anyways the issue is being all distorted as yes documents should not have leaked?  However since it has and the public is aware after the fact did the public not have a right to know.  Especially since they were promised this would never happen.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Whatever caused the leak its a done deal but there is no excuse especially from Larry Campbell who promised tax payers they would not be on the hook for any further costs and then goes on to defend bailout.  What happended?  The province  was on the hook not the city.  What happened to the province as Campbell promised to pick up the costs?Anyways the issue is being all distorted as yes documents should not have leaked?  However since it has and the public is aware after the fact did the public not have a right to know.  Especially since they were promised this would never happen.</p>
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		<title>By: T W</title>
		<link>http://www.francesbula.com/2008-vancouver-civic-election/mayors-defend-olympic-village/comment-page-1/#comment-1397</link>
		<dc:creator>T W</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 Nov 2008 16:35:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.francesbula.com/?p=596#comment-1397</guid>
		<description>In the worst case scenario, is the City ahead of or second to the provider of the construction loan at the Olympic Village, should there be a real estate melt down. That may be a substantial and unanticipated consequence.  Answers,  please,  from our elected representatives.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In the worst case scenario, is the City ahead of or second to the provider of the construction loan at the Olympic Village, should there be a real estate melt down. That may be a substantial and unanticipated consequence.  Answers,  please,  from our elected representatives.</p>
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		<title>By: RossK</title>
		<link>http://www.francesbula.com/2008-vancouver-civic-election/mayors-defend-olympic-village/comment-page-1/#comment-1390</link>
		<dc:creator>RossK</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 Nov 2008 03:47:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.francesbula.com/?p=596#comment-1390</guid>
		<description>Ms. Steele--

Agreed.

Unfortunately, however, &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yjnvSQuv-H4&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Bobby McFerrin&lt;/a&gt; is not in the running on Saturday.

.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ms. Steele&#8211;</p>
<p>Agreed.</p>
<p>Unfortunately, however, <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yjnvSQuv-H4" rel="nofollow">Bobby McFerrin</a> is not in the running on Saturday.</p>
<p>.</p>
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		<title>By: Dawn Steele</title>
		<link>http://www.francesbula.com/2008-vancouver-civic-election/mayors-defend-olympic-village/comment-page-1/#comment-1389</link>
		<dc:creator>Dawn Steele</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 Nov 2008 03:22:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.francesbula.com/?p=596#comment-1389</guid>
		<description>Anyone who refers to the certainty of some desired future event happening a year from now as a &quot;fact&quot; sure gets my BS meter humming.  I wouldn&#039;t even predict the certainty of my waking up on time tomorrow as a &quot;fact!&quot; 

And while I&#039;m certainly no expert, I didn&#039;t think the fuss was about whether it&#039;s OK to discuss sensitive issues in camera. I thought it was about whether the decision to OK a $100 million loan was properly informed, and/or about a leak that&#039;s got people worrying that the widely predicted &quot;Olympic hangover&quot; could be far worse than expected. 

Sam didn&#039;t address either question and I&#039;m not sure how two ex mayors who were not privy to those in camera discussions could do that for him. 

The totally patronizing pre-election mantra of Canadian politicians seems to be &quot;Don&#039;t worry, trust us, be happy.&quot;

Yeah, right!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Anyone who refers to the certainty of some desired future event happening a year from now as a &#8220;fact&#8221; sure gets my BS meter humming.  I wouldn&#8217;t even predict the certainty of my waking up on time tomorrow as a &#8220;fact!&#8221; </p>
<p>And while I&#8217;m certainly no expert, I didn&#8217;t think the fuss was about whether it&#8217;s OK to discuss sensitive issues in camera. I thought it was about whether the decision to OK a $100 million loan was properly informed, and/or about a leak that&#8217;s got people worrying that the widely predicted &#8220;Olympic hangover&#8221; could be far worse than expected. </p>
<p>Sam didn&#8217;t address either question and I&#8217;m not sure how two ex mayors who were not privy to those in camera discussions could do that for him. </p>
<p>The totally patronizing pre-election mantra of Canadian politicians seems to be &#8220;Don&#8217;t worry, trust us, be happy.&#8221;</p>
<p>Yeah, right!</p>
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		<title>By: RossK</title>
		<link>http://www.francesbula.com/2008-vancouver-civic-election/mayors-defend-olympic-village/comment-page-1/#comment-1388</link>
		<dc:creator>RossK</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 Nov 2008 03:19:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.francesbula.com/?p=596#comment-1388</guid>
		<description>tommi--

Not to go all fact-checker or anything on you, but how, exactly, did Vision act as the &#039;architect of the Millenium deal&#039; given that the deal was first recommended  to Council by City Staff in April of 2006  which occurred after the original 1:1:1 market/affordable/subsidized proposal that was designed by the previous Vision Council had already been trashed by the Sullivan/Ladner/Anton et al. NPA Council earlier that year?

Am I missing something in that chronology?

.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>tommi&#8211;</p>
<p>Not to go all fact-checker or anything on you, but how, exactly, did Vision act as the &#8216;architect of the Millenium deal&#8217; given that the deal was first recommended  to Council by City Staff in April of 2006  which occurred after the original 1:1:1 market/affordable/subsidized proposal that was designed by the previous Vision Council had already been trashed by the Sullivan/Ladner/Anton et al. NPA Council earlier that year?</p>
<p>Am I missing something in that chronology?</p>
<p>.</p>
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		<title>By: Wayne</title>
		<link>http://www.francesbula.com/2008-vancouver-civic-election/mayors-defend-olympic-village/comment-page-1/#comment-1387</link>
		<dc:creator>Wayne</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 Nov 2008 03:14:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.francesbula.com/?p=596#comment-1387</guid>
		<description>I despise Larry Campbell, always have. I was very curious to see why he would have anything to say about this and why we should care what he thinks. Keep in mind, he freely admitted that he didn&#039;t like reading all the reports that came across his desk when he was mayor which of course made him a natural choice for the Senate.

Lo and behold, CBC says good old Larry owns two units in the development but Larry doesn&#039;t want to talk about that. Just unbelievable.

I voted advanced and I know there are a couple of money questions on the ballot. Taxpayers can decide whether they want to authorize council to spend up to X dollars on various projects. If taxpayers have to authorize these projects how is it that council can enter into negotiations to the tune of $100.000.000.00 and tell us it is none of our business? And that we can just trust them. The more secretive they are the  more worried I am that this will end badly for the taxpayer.

I despise the Olympics too.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I despise Larry Campbell, always have. I was very curious to see why he would have anything to say about this and why we should care what he thinks. Keep in mind, he freely admitted that he didn&#8217;t like reading all the reports that came across his desk when he was mayor which of course made him a natural choice for the Senate.</p>
<p>Lo and behold, CBC says good old Larry owns two units in the development but Larry doesn&#8217;t want to talk about that. Just unbelievable.</p>
<p>I voted advanced and I know there are a couple of money questions on the ballot. Taxpayers can decide whether they want to authorize council to spend up to X dollars on various projects. If taxpayers have to authorize these projects how is it that council can enter into negotiations to the tune of $100.000.000.00 and tell us it is none of our business? And that we can just trust them. The more secretive they are the  more worried I am that this will end badly for the taxpayer.</p>
<p>I despise the Olympics too.</p>
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		<title>By: Richard Frizell</title>
		<link>http://www.francesbula.com/2008-vancouver-civic-election/mayors-defend-olympic-village/comment-page-1/#comment-1386</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard Frizell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 Nov 2008 02:54:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.francesbula.com/?p=596#comment-1386</guid>
		<description>I would suggest that the pundits on the Millenium file  get familiar with the &quot;Vancouver Charter&quot;which regulates the City of Vancouver and how it governs.

S.165.2 (1) gives council some discretion.

S.165.2 (2) gives the council no discretion (it would appear that the Millenium discussions would very well fall into this category.


Meetings that may or must be closed to the public

165.2  (1) A part of a Council meeting may be closed to the public if the subject matter being considered relates to or is one or more of the following:


(d) the security of the property of the city;

(e) the acquisition, disposition or expropriation of land or improvements, if the Council considers that disclosure could reasonably be expected to harm the interests of the city;

(k) negotiations and related discussions respecting the proposed provision of an activity, work or facility that are at their preliminary stages and that, in the view of the Council, could reasonably be expected to harm the interests of the city if they were held in public;


(2) A part of a Council meeting must be closed to the public if the subject matter being considered relates to one or more of the following:

(b) the consideration of information received and held in confidence relating to negotiations between the city and ....a third party; 

Perhaps if people want more openness at City Hall,  they really should be lobbying the provincial government to change the Vancouver Charter.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I would suggest that the pundits on the Millenium file  get familiar with the &#8220;Vancouver Charter&#8221;which regulates the City of Vancouver and how it governs.</p>
<p>S.165.2 (1) gives council some discretion.</p>
<p>S.165.2 (2) gives the council no discretion (it would appear that the Millenium discussions would very well fall into this category.</p>
<p>Meetings that may or must be closed to the public</p>
<p>165.2  (1) A part of a Council meeting may be closed to the public if the subject matter being considered relates to or is one or more of the following:</p>
<p>(d) the security of the property of the city;</p>
<p>(e) the acquisition, disposition or expropriation of land or improvements, if the Council considers that disclosure could reasonably be expected to harm the interests of the city;</p>
<p>(k) negotiations and related discussions respecting the proposed provision of an activity, work or facility that are at their preliminary stages and that, in the view of the Council, could reasonably be expected to harm the interests of the city if they were held in public;</p>
<p>(2) A part of a Council meeting must be closed to the public if the subject matter being considered relates to one or more of the following:</p>
<p>(b) the consideration of information received and held in confidence relating to negotiations between the city and &#8230;.a third party; </p>
<p>Perhaps if people want more openness at City Hall,  they really should be lobbying the provincial government to change the Vancouver Charter.</p>
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		<title>By: A. G. Tsakumis</title>
		<link>http://www.francesbula.com/2008-vancouver-civic-election/mayors-defend-olympic-village/comment-page-1/#comment-1385</link>
		<dc:creator>A. G. Tsakumis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 Nov 2008 02:15:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.francesbula.com/?p=596#comment-1385</guid>
		<description>Me thinks the Nutty One has spent some extra innings in the back of his &quot;smoggy&quot; van, and has emerged wearing the same pair of roseate glasses that he entered with.

He has injected himself again, knowing full well that the NPA will be decimated on Saturday, but wanting to ensure, too, that Pistol Pete&#039;s shooter is empty.

Sam is wily enough to know how unpopular he is, but he still comes out on this issue, with the knowledge that it has almost sank Peter (almost entirely unfairly);  ot he&#039;s too stupid to know that reminding voters of his ( even remote) connection to Peter will send them to the ballot box not just wanting to vote for Gregor, but have his baby too (and that&#039;s just the men)--either way, what a fool.

Obervations:

1) It is impossible to predict how this project will end up.  Sam&#039;s crystal ball needs a polish and somene that can actually read it properly...

2) The notion that everything is bright and cheery, against the backdrop of a global economic crisis that threatens the United States with a second financial tsunami in as many months, is as asinine as anything I&#039;ve ever heard from Sam.  Saying it&#039;s the case without one stitch of tangible proof is the raising of blowing smoke from a science to an art. In fact, if you graphed the events as they have unfolded from the beginning, and followed the trend, the whole thing would be in Palinesque territory:  Indecipherable babble followed by harsh reality, the best intentions notwithstanding.

3) The project should have NEVER gone to Millennium.  Both Peter Wall and Terry Hui had bigger pockets and greater experience at building this type of site.  So, the comment about how the very best interests of taxpayers was paramount to staff, is utter horse shit.  Wall and Concord have billions in assets.  Millennium has not--ever.

4) The city had no business getting into the speculation game...when Millennium couldn&#039;t write a cheque for the whole deal, that should have sent alarm bells ringing to the point of cracking.  No money no honey, honey.  A $30 million cheque on a deal that large isn&#039;t enough.  In fact, you wouldn&#039;t take that in any kind of economy, because the current scenario should have been blueskyed as on of the potential default positions!!!  Wh at the city was watching for this Sam?!

5) What assets do Millennium have that we can fall back on?  This whole thing will come down to  selling the remaining condos at a market price that will not return for at least three years.  Most of their more profitable projects are either cellared or stalled.  Nice.

So, who will end up holding the bag for all this...

The same people who were screwed senseless for the last three years of fantasy initiatives, failed policy and pretense...

YOU.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Me thinks the Nutty One has spent some extra innings in the back of his &#8220;smoggy&#8221; van, and has emerged wearing the same pair of roseate glasses that he entered with.</p>
<p>He has injected himself again, knowing full well that the NPA will be decimated on Saturday, but wanting to ensure, too, that Pistol Pete&#8217;s shooter is empty.</p>
<p>Sam is wily enough to know how unpopular he is, but he still comes out on this issue, with the knowledge that it has almost sank Peter (almost entirely unfairly);  ot he&#8217;s too stupid to know that reminding voters of his ( even remote) connection to Peter will send them to the ballot box not just wanting to vote for Gregor, but have his baby too (and that&#8217;s just the men)&#8211;either way, what a fool.</p>
<p>Obervations:</p>
<p>1) It is impossible to predict how this project will end up.  Sam&#8217;s crystal ball needs a polish and somene that can actually read it properly&#8230;</p>
<p>2) The notion that everything is bright and cheery, against the backdrop of a global economic crisis that threatens the United States with a second financial tsunami in as many months, is as asinine as anything I&#8217;ve ever heard from Sam.  Saying it&#8217;s the case without one stitch of tangible proof is the raising of blowing smoke from a science to an art. In fact, if you graphed the events as they have unfolded from the beginning, and followed the trend, the whole thing would be in Palinesque territory:  Indecipherable babble followed by harsh reality, the best intentions notwithstanding.</p>
<p>3) The project should have NEVER gone to Millennium.  Both Peter Wall and Terry Hui had bigger pockets and greater experience at building this type of site.  So, the comment about how the very best interests of taxpayers was paramount to staff, is utter horse shit.  Wall and Concord have billions in assets.  Millennium has not&#8211;ever.</p>
<p>4) The city had no business getting into the speculation game&#8230;when Millennium couldn&#8217;t write a cheque for the whole deal, that should have sent alarm bells ringing to the point of cracking.  No money no honey, honey.  A $30 million cheque on a deal that large isn&#8217;t enough.  In fact, you wouldn&#8217;t take that in any kind of economy, because the current scenario should have been blueskyed as on of the potential default positions!!!  Wh at the city was watching for this Sam?!</p>
<p>5) What assets do Millennium have that we can fall back on?  This whole thing will come down to  selling the remaining condos at a market price that will not return for at least three years.  Most of their more profitable projects are either cellared or stalled.  Nice.</p>
<p>So, who will end up holding the bag for all this&#8230;</p>
<p>The same people who were screwed senseless for the last three years of fantasy initiatives, failed policy and pretense&#8230;</p>
<p>YOU.</p>
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		<title>By: tommi</title>
		<link>http://www.francesbula.com/2008-vancouver-civic-election/mayors-defend-olympic-village/comment-page-1/#comment-1384</link>
		<dc:creator>tommi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 Nov 2008 01:52:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.francesbula.com/?p=596#comment-1384</guid>
		<description>The fact that Vision/COPE was the original architect of the Millennium deal AND voted unanimously for the loan makes them a bunch of hypocrites. Exposing confidential city business for political gain is sleazy, reckless and incredibly irresponsible. Their claim that they voted YES without knowing all the details is a shocking statement that the media has let slide. So, they were against this loan before they voted for it?? It&#039;s all just a strawman to distract voters from looking too closely at the Sarah Palin of Vancouver: Gregor Robertson. All flash and little substance. 

Vision&#039;s well-funded smear campaign has worked, but, it will ultimately be to the detriment of Vancouver voters. Buyer&#039;s Remorse, here we come.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The fact that Vision/COPE was the original architect of the Millennium deal AND voted unanimously for the loan makes them a bunch of hypocrites. Exposing confidential city business for political gain is sleazy, reckless and incredibly irresponsible. Their claim that they voted YES without knowing all the details is a shocking statement that the media has let slide. So, they were against this loan before they voted for it?? It&#8217;s all just a strawman to distract voters from looking too closely at the Sarah Palin of Vancouver: Gregor Robertson. All flash and little substance. </p>
<p>Vision&#8217;s well-funded smear campaign has worked, but, it will ultimately be to the detriment of Vancouver voters. Buyer&#8217;s Remorse, here we come.</p>
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